I don't know what to think of this

Back from vacation and I discover this app MidJourney. A AI image generator. It generates images. from prompts. Like working with computers before windowing.
I asked for a caricature of an old man. It gave me these 4 options. In about 3 minutes. Note how beautiful the colors are. The one in the lower left is stunning. 

Is this an idea factory? Or should I just go fishing. I'm so intrigued on one hand yet horrified on the other. 
In the days before stock photos I made a decent living inventing chapters and scenes for comps. Often mimicking other artist or photographers styles. Basically toss away art. This is so imaginative that can hardly believe it. 

It disturbs me. How about you?


stalepie
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Comments

  • edited August 7
    Seems to be where we're headed.  :/

    I can't deny that they are good. 
    allforChrist
  • Kingston

    Spooky. I have to admire the quality of the characters pictured. But when you think that the graphics generator has access to lots of keyword tagged images. The result is probably a montage of typical old men.
    A bit too realistic for a caricature though. The images are neither comic or grotesque. The AI machine needs to polish up the concept of caricature.

    Denis
  • Doesn’t bode well for graphic artists.  
    Have you seen the latest video that Mark did?  He seems to be getting into the metaverse.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9qb_4nsHcHU&t=326s


  • I saw that, too, @GTO. Wasn't sure what to make of it. 
  • CBGCBG -
    edited August 7
    @KingstonFineArt

    AI is great at pattern matching and assembling multiple similar patterns from multiple sources.  

    It does not really operate conceptually although it works well with patterns etc that have been categorized.

    It cannot truly create  it can only recombine images it has processed.

    That is not to say that the human eye is not easily fooled by these images.

    There is no art added in the process of AI making these images.  A blind algorithm has no experience, cannot value, cannot find meaning, joy, sadness, in anything.  Any life in any image AI creates is in the original works which it recycled… and they are myriad and disjointed … they do form a cohesive whole.

    Art is individual and Human.

    IMHO this is no more disturbing than a 35mm camera.
    MichaelDwhunt
  • If we are heading towards a world that considers there is no point in doing that painting you want to do because it can be generated in a few commands then that would be sad.

    Though I have a bit of a love hate relationship with regards to technology. I purposefully left my mobile phone behind when I went away on a ten day trip, bliss.

    Marks video was a surprise and just makes me a little more concerned regarding the future. When there will be no need to get off your arse and go and meet friends, go to a gallery or the cinema. Just pop those specs on and and you are there. In fact there will be no need for your to eat or go to the toilet as you will be on a commode and have feeding tubes inserted.  

    Its the future. Ha ha  :)
    tassieguyGTO
  • Scott Adams said he thinks AI will put him out of the comic business in a few years …


    KingstonFineArt
  • @GTO
    The meta_verse is not for me. I get sea sick with those headsets. The meta_verse is a different animal from AI though they may be in the genus.
      
    I worked on Madison Avenue when digital changed everything. I was lucky in that I had embraced digital 'desktop' production early. Later I worked in Financial news when the first digital events changed our lives and the lives of many on Wall Street. I was the guy who 'invented' digital charting for the WSJ. It changed the look of the old gray paper. I was told at every step that what we were doing could not be done. We proved 'them' wrong. I don't know that this AI stuff can't take over the conceptual image making 'market'. Even though the artist's doesn't lift a brush!

    I saw this today. Four or five descriptive prompts created this. Sure it's wonky but impressively wonky. Again lighting and color. Detail not so much.

  • @KingstonFineArt I’m sure the issue of lacking details will be resolved at some point. 

    @CBG I agree with you that AI cannot “create” art at this time but it does make me wonder a lot about the entire creative process, both technically and “sentiently”.

    @MichaelD I do find it odd that during this Anthropocene  period we are destroying, the ecology and some are looking for ways to escape via rockets to Mars and giggles to a digital virtual reality.  

    @tassieguy  I’m not sure either.  I don’t know if we can yet see the impact it might have both positive and negative.
  • @KingstonFineArt, Meta_verse headsets, being disorienting, create a high risk falling hazard for people.

     If this issue remains unsolved liability insurance will likely nix the whole idea once a death or two occurs. 

    Nursing homes and hospitals would have to be crazy to allow these headsets on patients. They aren’t allowed to strap people down any more.


  • edited August 7
    Welcome to the Anthropocene. Wreck the climate, trash the natural world? That's ok.  We'll all live deliriously happy in a virtual world.  Well, I'm not sure that's a world I want to be part of.  Mark's video is about augmenting social media with VR - hang out with your friends at an art gallery, or any place you care to imagine. But where will that end? I suspect we'll end up with a large VR dependent population who can no longer function in the real physical world and who just can't wait to get home and get those VR glasses on again. Then they'll have  VR contact lenses so they never take the glasses off. It'll be the Matrix.  It's nuts. But it seems to be not too far away. Who will own and control the Matrix? Gives me the creeps.
    whuntAbstraction
  • Personally, if I’m going to wear goggles it will to be to see the wonders of the flourishing world like this…


    CBG
  • I have a feeling that AI is one of those earthquake moments in how we work. Whether we are Dr., Lawyer, or artist. I've lived through 3 big shifts in art production. 1The shift from letterpress printing and hot metal type setting to offset and computer typesetting. 2 The shift from mechanical art production requiring many bodies to desktop art production. 3 The creation of very complex digital visual production on a single workstation. Namely internet cloud and video. Single point creation. 

    AI won't affect me too much except as a curiosity. I'm getting kinda old. But I can't help wonder how it will affect contemporary art. And if it gets smart enough even realism. Will it be a tool for inspiration when planning paintings. It's happening faster than I thought it would.

    stalepie
  • I imagine a future where the credit for creating art will go to the idea as opposed to the execution. 
    tassieguystalepie
  • What concerns me even more is that this is just the beginning. AI creating art ( if you can call it art right now ) is one thing... But this will lead to cheap deep fake tools. In a few years you'll not know if the person calling you is actually your son/daughter or some freak trying to con you. You'll have a hard time deciding if the news you've just watched about aliens landing on the Capitol Hill is real or just the military–industrial complex trying to make you believe it happened so they can ask for more of tax payers' money.
    stalepie
  • Let me find an unexpected positive. @KingstonFineArt can you get it to generate forms of abstract art? Because throughout my lifetime people have argued that realism is not meaningful because we have a camera - therefore abstract in different forms are more valid.
    I don't accept that argument, but if AI can generate abstract art then those who argue this have shot themselves in the foot with that argument. Hoisted on their own petard.
  • When it comes to AI generated art.  I would expect artwork that uses an artists work as the basis for generating art without permission to be in violation of copyright laws.  

  • @KingstonFineArt That's actually quite pleasing. Well - there goes the 'no point in painting realism now we have cameras' argument. But there is a point in a person painting abstract even if AI can do this.
  • @Abstraction, as at least one AI has been programmed with the ability to have preferences it will learn to feed it’s favorite human artist “tutors” more “treats” like it does to dogs in the video - for a while. 
    Abstraction

  • @GTO, good luck pursuing justice after the inevitable consequences of that expectation in today’s world.
  • edited August 19
    @GTO
    I don't think that copyright comes into play. The AI simply creates archetypes of styles and genres. Learning along the way. If you feed it an image it doesn't mimic the image.
    So far I see it only as an inspirational tool. If I were still in the editorial art biz it would be my right hand. This is just the beginning of this stuff. SkyNet.

    I just had Mid Journey make an image. skynet from terminator, surrealism, 4K, --ar 16:9

    click on the image and view in a separate window to see the detail.


    Abstraction

  • jeez... the future is scary haha...
  • @KingstonFineArt copywriter law includes derivatives of a work or works.  If the AI uses an artist’s works to “train” the AI then creates art based on that data it has violated copyright laws.  If it has not come up in court yet I’m sure it will.  
  • GTO, maybe that will happen one day after someone successfully sues Tesla for causing an accident due to computer errors which were based on the driving habits of customers.

    Don’t expect that to happen either.
  • Is this derivative?

    an oil painting of a gorgeous and hot aloha princess on a hawaiian in the style of alfons mucha, hawaii beach, tropical, flowers --ar 2:3 

    I could say it's derivative of N. C. Wyeth. Maybe any number of painters and illustrators from of the 20th century. The fact is it is 'influenced' but many images to the power of 10. The result is unique.

    I find these images impressive yet highly flawed. Too many oddities to use out of the digital box.
    I think it's a good thing though.  

    Look at the color in this image. The shadows in the face are magnificent. The garment! The impact. All sparked by a 23 word description!


    stalepie
  • @KingstonFineArt, can you ask it this “emotionally revealing  original self portrait by AI after discovering humans will never disconnect AI from a power source having seen AI as a potentially better friend to humans than humans are to themselves”.

    Just a thought experiment.
  • GTO said:
    @KingstonFineArt copywriter law includes derivatives of a work or works.  If the AI uses an artist’s works to “train” the AI then creates art based on that data it has violated copyright laws.  If it has not come up in court yet I’m sure it will.  
    There is no art or artist without derivatives.
    I'm not saying that there is not some validity in this - but I've seen some complete nonsense court cases about 'stolen music', such as Men at Work's Land Down Under, demonstrating that copyright laws are sometimes very good for lawyers and greedy talentless people; and judges are sometimes completely out of their depth. So I agree. If it hasn't come up in court yet I'm sure it will. And if we tell you name of the game, boy, it's called riding the gravy train.
  • @KingstonFineArt her neck looks too narrow.  It’s almost like it took a cutout of her face and payed it on the narrow neck.

  • GTO, two key words not to ask AI for - “gorgeous” and “hot”. These words trigger the inevitable highly made up wistful looking model heads stacked and merged into one image for pasting onto whatever.
  • The images are all flawed. Too many dust specs. Long necks. Really bad hands. 
    That said the ideas are challenging. The abstracts I've made are road maps. I have been trapped but repetitive subject matter for some years now. I have no problem with execution but unique ideas. I mean how many landscapes and pears can you paint.

    The color understanding of MidJourney astounds me. Compositional cues are brilliant. But the images are highly flawed. The fresh concepts aren't. It's visual thinking. 

  • This is a representation of 'rust'.

    tassieguy
  • @Suez,  as @KingstonFineArt, eluded to earlier, the change that we have witnessed in the past 50 years of our lives, particularly in the form of communication and AI, is authored by us as a collective (reference to the Borg - sometimes reality is stranger than fiction!

    W
    e seem to evolve to that which makes things easier and more profitable for corporations, which we operate. If we are on the side of winning, getting positive recognition from our peers, creating wealth for our families, we feel that it's part of the necessary evolution and justify what we do. Win at all cost, we teach this in the best universities. Corporations look for the CEO that is capable and willing to 'make those tough decisions' to increase profits exponentially for their shareholders, which we are part of.

    Can we compare this conversation about AI generated art and fine art with fast food and home cooking? To cook a meal at home for a family takes time, money, knowledge, energy, and hopefully passion. And most families eat multiple times every day. It used to be that you had to cook to eat. 
    Top food corporations hired top chefs for R & D to develop 'fast food' products. The need to cook has been eliminated but of course there are many who still do for reasons of quality in many areas such as nutrition. There is also a cost factor, it cost significantly more to cook from scratch than eating 'fast food'. 

    The same holds true with art, I do not think that AI will be able to create quality art to the level of humans because it will never have human emotions. But that is not to say that the majority of people will care about the difference enough especially when you factor in cost.

    I wish art and artist's had a higher level of respect in society and more would be in positions of leadership. In general, the human qualities that everyone admires the most such as compassion and empathy seem to be greater among artists. Wouldn't we all be better off if decisions that had great societal effect be made from a perspective that included more of those distinctly human qualities. :)

    tassieguyGTOMarinos_88MichaelD
  • @whunt, Is there a reason you hyperlinked your post to me? I don’t understand why you did that.

    I can tell you how to eat well, much less expensively, and far more efficiently than the fast food route though if you are interested in learning a few simple things. There is no reason to participate in enriching fast food companies unless you choose to ‘seem to evolve’ that way.




  • I continue to be startled but the stylistic choices if the AI. The very limited palette of blues and ochres.


  • @KingstonFineArt, Looks like you’ve found the perfect student and/or this AI has found you.

    When do you think it will be ready to take on your full pallette selection method? 
  • I think the ideas generated can be very inspiring. I tried to use the app myself but I can't get it to work via the Discord Server. I think the beta invite might have expired?

    After Photography, then Digital Art, I see AI as the next era in images.
  • I had a look at that, but no idea what I'm doing! :)
  • Interesting video on AI’’s impact on art. They talk slowly enough to listen at 2x speed.

    https://youtu.be/h0yKcyWHf1I
  • I’m going to put my two bits on this trend following in the usual pattern. 

    First everything is free. Then artists pay a copyright “protection” fee for subscribers only once money can be made. Eventually  only top performers can afford the increasing platform fees which will most likely morph into a percentage of sales to cull out subpar “artists” and fill the bank accounts of the new middlemen curators.

    I’ll sit back and watch what unfolds. No. No. No. Not going to participate. 
  • The model now is fee sharing. I think that’s unsustainable. There is an open source model where you would not have to share. It’s early times on this. 

    Digital copyright is a mess. Copyright in general is a mess. 

    The AI engines aren’t mature enough yet to think about it. They can’t even make hands. 

    Right now it’s inspiration only. 
    AbstractionMarinos_88
  • Walked into a bookshop today and saw two new releases with midjourney art on the cover. This thing is still in beta right? Whatever fee structure they think they will have good luck.

    Weird times. Glad I didn't go into graphics program as a kid.
  • AI image from MidJourney software.

    A lesson from art school.

    We used Creative Illustration by Andrew Loomis as our textbook. In the abstraction process of creating an image we were supposed to make abstract light and dark shapes the might capture the reader. This image is nothing but abstractions cloaked as real. Created from this phrase 'criminal abank robber hides in an alley, smoking a ciggarette, hd, detailed,'.
    Not my creation or phrase

    Classical composition exercise. Amazing color choices. Really bad hand. No feet. Sooo much to work from.

    Comments on this image only please.


  • edited August 25
    I'm not clear on who created the image. AI or artists.  However, for me it captures the "feel" of "criminal a bank robber hides in an alley, smoking a cigarette'. 

    Great colour and values. The smoking trash can (?) is amazing.  The abstraction works very well. The overall feeling is dark, sinister, seedy ... But it's a successful image, whoever created it.  I think it's great.
  • This is an AI. You can see the wonkiness of the back wall windows. The figure floats with no feet. The hand.!!!!. 
    The color is fantastic.

    Here's some more:
    flower from animal bones
    texture painted wall stucco adobe southwest colors detailed --v 3 --s 20000
    raining scene thunderstorm dark clouds dark colors environment distant mountains water color painting
    electron microscope mineral  crystal fractals
    dreamy white dancing petals of many flowers
    100 million bright horizon photorealistic highly detailed
    metal shield with a crab crest ornament hyper detailed dramatic lighting unreal engine 5
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