Any updates on Geneva Paints?

Has anyone heard how the progress is going with Geneva Fine Arts? I can imagine it will take months to get back into production. 

I purchased a set of Geneva paints back in the spring and started my hobby again after a 35+ year break. Finding Draw, Mix, Paint and Mark's remarkable method of teaching made such a huge impact on my path forward. This sounds pretty selfish and whiny but I am concerned about losing my momentum for fear of running out of Geneva oil paints. I am frugal by nature so I don't think I have wasted paint so far but, with Geneva Fine Arts' challenge of getting back on its feet, I think about every pool of paint I put on the palette. 

Geneva oil paints are the only ones I've used. Will it be a learning curve to change to a different brand? I hate the idea of investing in even more supplies - what else will I need?
CarolAnn

Comments

  • dencaldencal -
    edited August 6
    Nanj

    FIRE AT GENEVA HEADQUARTERS


    You can sign up for email newsletters at that link.

    Denis


  • Thanks, Denis, I think I did sign up. I thought maybe some of the forum members might have "inside scoop". Just trying to decide what to do about replenishing my oil paints.
    CarolAnn
  • I’m in the same situation, Nani. I am a beginner and I’m not sure how to proceed. I learned of the fire after a lot of research and had finally made the decision to purchase his paint and buy his products. 

    I’d also welcome an update so I know if I can/should wait or move forward with alternatives. 
  • @NanJ and @CarolAnn I use and prefer Mark's Geneva paints, but also use other brands.  The Geneva paints work best for Mark's techniques, but it is also possible to use other brands.  Not the same though.  They dry faster and don't handle the same way Geneva paints do.

    However, what I would recommend is to get artist grade Winsor Newton paints (NOT Winton) in the Colors that Mark recommends.  Instead of the Pyrrole Rubine, use their Permanent Alizarin Crimson Hue.  

    Next use the recipes and instructions that Mark gives on making up your own Slow Dry Medium and mix it with the Winsor Newton according to Mark's instructions.  This will give you a paint that's pretty close to Mark's and will hold you until Mark can get going again.

    I have some Geneva and also have made up some W&N with Mark's Slow Dry recipes.  His recipes work!

    Here's the page with the instructions and recipes:
    Supply List | Draw Mix Paint

    BOB73Cynthia
  • Thank you so much for the guidance, @mstrick96 . I really appreciate it!  
  • Thank you @mstrick96 for your reply. It is good to hear from someone with first hand experience. I've priced out supplies to make the Slow Dry Medium and will check out W-N oils. 

    I had been researching other oils that might have handling properties close to Geneva such as M. Graham made with walnut oil. I went back and watched some of Mark's videos about oil paints and SDM and came to the conclusion I will have to suck it up and spend the money to approximate Geneva oils. And now that you suggest W-N oils, I realized Mark recommends W-N for international customers so he has experience with the brand and SDM.

    I am still so new at Mark's methods that it would not help my progress to introduce paints with different handling properties.
    CarolAnn
  • edited August 21
    I would just add that the WN recipes ARE Mark's paints, they are the ones he used in his long art career.  If you look at earlier videos, those were the paints he used even as recently as then.  And he continues to add more paints to the range.  One can surmise what he would have used before those were available, if he had needed the hot points.


    Of course his line of paints (own some), supersede these mixes, and do not contain the toxic elements in the mixes.

  • Good point, @TamDeal.  They are Mark's recipes that he used before he started making his own line of paint.  

    If you compare the cost of buying Geneva paints to other quality brands, they are very comparable.  I love the slow drying characteristics!  

    I hope Mark can get Geneva up and running again soon!  I saw that they will be moving to larger facilities so maybe this fire will turn out to be a blessing in disguise.
    Cynthia
  • I've started out on DMP fairly recently and have never used Geneva paints.  Some that I use are really cheap, and some are in between.  But it doesn't really matter.  So long as your blue paint is very dark and your yellow paint is light, that seems to be the only key thing to look out for.  Your paintings will still turn out great and the method will still apply and work wonderfully.
    Hope this helps.
  • mstrick96 said:
    Good point, @TamDeal.  They are Mark's recipes that he used before he started making his own line of paint.  

    If you compare the cost of buying Geneva paints to other quality brands, they are very comparable.  I love the slow drying characteristics!
    I agree, I don't think one saves much money, even considering that the paints are somewhat diluted, IF, one is inside the US.  And the smaller sizes mean less outlay, and are preferred by some.

    Utrecht is probably the cheapest good brand, but they did not ship well, and I have oil all over the place.
  • edited August 25
    I've started out on DMP fairly recently and have never used Geneva paints.  Some that I use are really cheap, and some are in between.  But it doesn't really matter.  So long as your blue paint is very dark and your yellow paint is light, that seems to be the only key thing to look out for.  Your paintings will still turn out great and the method will still apply and work wonderfully.
    Hope this helps.

    Depends what you consider to be the method.  I have broken his method down a lot to work around the open times, when painting in winter with acrylics.  There are a lot of work arounds.

    The problem with limited palettes is getting true colours.  These normally require some cadmiums.  Those are expensive, hues can sometimes be a problem.  Mark seems to have found true colours that aren't expensive or toxic.

    I have played around with cheap paints a lot, there are some good options. And there are ways of getting around open times.

    There is at least one new technique that promises to require a lot less in the way of mixing, and works pretty well for landscapes, but I am just now trying it for portraits, I kinda doubt it will do the photo realism Mark wants, but not everyone wants that anyway.
  • @TamDeal,
    Out of curiosity, what is the "new method"?  I do mostly landscapes and portraits, so you've gotten me curious!
  • It uses chromatic transparent black.  You lay in the values, and then you can just drop in the colors.  Because the blacks are transparent, you are supposed to be able to drop in an equal value color and it doesn't mess up the lay in.  You can work with 3 to 5 values (or however many you want).  But since it is unlikely that every color will be completely value neutral, you can shift the values a little.  This means you can do the block in of values in say 3 values, and get a good basic design in, and you can still sift the values to get more precision. 

    Gamblin in making the workable chromatic black, and it is fairly cheap.  Since you don't have to mix your values in often expensive colors, it saves you money as well.

    I did a plein air the other day, and totally screwed it up, so I am not bowled over yet, but that was obviously me.  I did notice how you could drop color into the black and get the value of the hue, relatively easily.  But I kinda lost control after I started.  I made a few other mistakes, so basically I ended up revising for most of the session.  Certainly an interesting concept.

    There are a lot of things that rate as chromatic black, but they won't all work for this, as the underlying paints here are transparent, and also the right mix of hues to have the least polluting effects on the colors you drop in.

    I haven't really fathomed what would happen DMP style with this approach.  My PA stuff is usually pretty fast.
  • @TamDeal
    I've done something similar that I learned from Amanda Lovett.   I do a value painting  in several values using the white of the canvas to lighten the values of either Cassel Earth or Transparent Oxide Red.  Then I drop in the colors.

    These browns work pretty well for landscapes.  

    I don;t use it regularly though.

    I don;t think it would work well with Mark's methods though!

  • I don't see why it wouldn't work if one could get the CB to stay open long enough.  My problem with the idea was just that is is a more painterly way to work, where you are not trying to render every dot to perfection.  I completely agree with you that it would be a stretch.  If one makes all the pre-mixed puddles on can simply drop them in.  To me the CB method is more about speed in the field, or even a live sitting.
  • @TamDeal
    I'm working to develop more speed for plein air.  I have a competition coming up in October and want to be able to make a good showing!

  • My objective as a beginner is just to make something beautiful.  Say I am standing in front of a pond and trees, and I do a picture, and it comes out not really looking much like the  image in front of me.  I am working on it looking nice.  So when I later look at the picture I will like what I see.  Paint is beautiful, so if I just put paint on it is beautiful, because the paint is beautiful.  But that isn't a picture, that is a paint sample.

    Sorta like playing music, even a relative beginner can play a very simple tune musically.  But anything too difficult ends up a mess.  But if one never learned to play a simple piece beautifully, one might eventually be able to mess up a complicated piece also.  If one doesn't force the discipline to make beauty from the first, when does it happen?

    This is my thought for the day.

    Of course accuracy won't happen by itself either, so it all has to be worked on.
    tassieguy
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