Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

You can send an email to [email protected] if you have questions about how to use this forum.

What's happened?

Comments

  • FlattyFlatty admin
    Disappointing yes! I have to respect his wishes
    PaulBMoeyMichele
  • edited December 2017
    Most unfortunate! and yes, best to respect his wishes. Thanks so much for everything.
    MoeyMichele
  • So sorry to hear that.  I'm new to this forum but have read through many, many posts and learned a ton.  My impression is that Kingston was among those with the most to teach. He spoke his mind instead of offering platitudes. As a new member who will likely soon be posting the awful initial efforts of a beginner, I appreciated his honesty.
    ForgivenessMoeyMichelemichalis
  • I told you he was sensitive. He didn't remove all of his content the last time he left. I will miss him... again.
    SummerMoeyMicheleForgiveness
  • SummerSummer -
    edited December 2017
    I was about to save that cartoon of his that he originally posted a year ago.  Did anyone else happen to save it? It showed several remedies to a hangover.  Now you guys know why I save your paintings to my desktop.  I just recently began saving cartoons, but not soon enough.   :)  

    Here is a happy page of his work that I thoroughly enjoyed today: http://jimkingston.com/index#/oilsansacrylics/

    Guess I'll have to wait for his book to get that cartoon.  Hmm.

    MoeyMicheleBOB73
  • What a wonderful collection of art, thanks for posting @Summer
    SummerMoeyMichele
  • Thanks everyone.  I enjoyed his contributions although they were on the blunt side perhaps.  @Summer thanks for posting the link! :)
    SummerForgiveness
  • edited December 2017
    I was also impressed with his bio in a earlier thread named "What is your day job?". When I was in college briefly in 1984/85 studying Fine Art, Illustration and Graphic Design, we studied just what these artists like Kingston were doing in big cities especially New York. We were in awe and recognized the talent and wisdom behind some of this and they became our mentors and even idols/heroes in some cases. At that time (1984) I just finished helping a company to create one of our very first computers for home and business, and left in order to go to art college out of town and was in awe at what some of these artists were already doing with photography and film and animation on their very expensive high grade computers already, at that time as well (I only knew of Pac Man previous this, ha,ha!). I will miss him too. About him being on the blunt side, this is taught in college in a live situation and becomes the norm and even more so in cut throat businesses quite unlike what we have here on this forum.
    SummerMoeyMichelealsartBOB73
  • Does anyone know exactly why he left? Doesn't seem that there was any warning unless I missed something. I don't mean to pry...this is just quite a shock. 
    Forgiveness
  • Wow that's a shame. He had his quircks but I liked him. I always appreciated how much thought and detail went in to some of his posts. 
    ForgivenessFlattyalsartmichalis
  • edited December 2017
    He did leave warning signs, quite a shock to also take away "everything" he brought with him. However much of what he brought can be learned by anyone if they wish. Much is referenced in "Andrew Loomis" books and his color charts. I will still miss him regardless, great to work with him looked forward to it, good hard work though. I learned a lot from him, now for me to continue to incorporate it and develop through my own paintings, my own decision.
    edavison
  • It's a tragedy.  He added a lot of life to this forum.  Professor emeritus Kingston shall be missed.
    JuliannaIrishcajunmichalis
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
    Forgiveness
  • Well.  This is upsetting.  KINGSTON!!!!!!   I LOVE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!  PLEASE COME BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • Ah, that's a shame.
    Forgiveness
  • Folks

    I think Kingston will return. He likes the praise and gets more of that here than elsewhere.
    He goads some folks with his sharp tongue and gets upset when he gets it paid back.

    Denis


    edavisonRichard_PMoeyMicheletassieguy
  • This is reassuring come from you Denis, thank you. I really miss him.
  • I wish he hadn't taken all his toys with him when he left. There was some wonderful stuff he posted that I hoped to revisit after getting down the fundamentals with DMP. I can't draw freehand anymore like when I was a teenager so I was counting on his drawing lessons and all that composition stuff too. Not to mention his dry-brush water colors--- they were really amazing.
    ForgivenessSummerMoeyMichele
  • edited January 5
    Some of us were very fortunate to acquire some wonderful stuff that he posted, only with his permission with a promise/agreement not to share nor distribute freely with anyone, this is very clear. I have plans to keep my promise/agreement I made with him and the others. That's quite an impact and influence he made on me in such short period of time!
    BOB73
  • SummerSummer -
    edited January 6
    He's not the type to do nothing.  I'm hoping he will make new paintings and write a book this time out while watching over us at the same time just lurking.  :)
  • PaulB said:
    ... As a new member who will likely soon be posting the awful initial efforts of a beginner, I appreciated his honesty.
    You'll still get honesty, and plenty of it.  Make sure to ask for critique.

    Understand though that some new members are a little nervous about posting, maybe intimidated, and as someone offering critique, I'll try to give a combination of honest feedback and some encouragement.  It is so easy to kill all enthusiasm with harsh feedback, and noone wants that.

    You said it yourself, "... awful initial efforts ...", and that may be your self-deprecating nature, but it's not good to make new members think of their first step as awful, because it never is.  It's just a first step, a foundation to guide the second and third steps.

    And as this site proves, there aren't that many steps between beginning and producing impressive work.
    PaulB I could not agree more with the above :)
    PaulBIrishcajuntassieguy
  • I for one can second the above 
  • edited January 8
    I'm really sorry that Kingston "spat the dummy" (some might need to Google that) and decided to leave again. He is very experienced and knowledgeable.  He'll be missed. Perhaps Kingston's chief difficulty is not so much his messages but the way he delivers them. It's almost as if he is incapable of reflecting upon how his words might effect others. But, then, when others take offense and push back, he spits the dummy and storms off. Anyway, I do hope he comes back.  Third time lucky, maybe. He has a lot to offer.
    jswartzartMoeyMichele
  • edited January 8
    Part of this is the wide range of sensitivity/reactions to critiques, which is a recurring issue with any group of creative people. I edit a lot of people’s writing, and some people want the full treatment and others just expect to hear how perfect their first draft was.  Personally I want brutal honesty and I don’t mind if the delivery is blunt.  But that’s just me.   In law, we practice before a “murder board” of our colleagues before we ever present an argument to a judge, so you can imagine how pleasant that can be. I’m sure that’s how it was delivered when Kingston worked as an illustrator. Perhaps what this forum needs is a separate structured critique channel
    like wetcanvas.  http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28315. I haven’t posted there in years so I don’t know if it helps 
    ForgivenesstassieguyEliza
  • edited January 8
    Most people want honesty. Few want insults. Since there is no "structured critique channel" here maybe it's wise to aim for a happy medium somewhere  between encouragement and rudeness.   :)
    jswartzartMartin_J_CraneBOB73MoeyMichele
  • Interesting thought on critiques Mark once said in all his years of teaching the thing that seemed to help students most is not telling them what they did wrong but asking them why they painted it that way, what’s the difference between what you painted and what you see, is yours as subtle, did you color check it, why not.... (something along those lines... it’s in one of the videos) 

    At any rate .... the point I believe was not pointing out what they did wrong but actually questioning them so they can learn to see it themselves. 

    I believe the delivery of critiques is important be honest yes but with a view to teaching so that someone becomes a better artist. Commend on the good things painted correctly and help a person see for themselves where improvements can be made.
    People have enough negativity in life without adding to it.

    It serves no purpose to endlessly argue a critique into the ground. 

    On Kingston... great artist, some valuable insights, yet delivery off putting and I often had a hard time following his train of thought. 

    Do I think he should have left, no. Should he have reigned his comments in a bit, yes.

    tassieguyPaulBedavisonMoeyMichele
  • I personally have grown with the good and bad critique over the last few months, if you ask for critique then you should be prepared for what ever comes, without the critique and help I have received via this channel I may not be painting with oils today...
    kingston was very harsh with my proposed still life set ups, but he was 100% correct, I hope he returns,...
  • edited January 8
    Well, people come and go for various reasons. Best of both worlds for me has been to continue to be part of this forum and also to stay in touch with those who have a wealth of knowledge to share but have moved on.  
    tassieguyMoeyMicheleEliza
  • Jim and a few of us other old timers grew up in a time when teachers were expected to crack the whip and point out students' errors. By the time students were in college, criticism could be brutal and worse than that once into the marketplace of real commercial art. Jim thought of himself as a teacher and rightly so. I don't think any of his comments came out of meaness.
    Martin_J_CranejrbgolfsElizamichalis
  • HilaryHilary -
    edited January 8
    BOB73 said:
    Jim and a few of us other old timers grew up in a time when teachers were expected to crack the whip and point out students' errors. By the time students were in college, criticism could be brutal and worse than that once into the marketplace of real commercial art. Jim thought of himself as a teacher and rightly so. I don't think any of his comments came out of meaness.
    I take your point  @BOB73 , and you’re totally right about that sort of harsh , autocratic approach to teaching  that existed in the past. 
    But thankfully I think things have moved on since then and that approach is no longer acceptable any more than corporal punishment for children is tolerated.  
    Anyone who posts a photo of their work here does so with the expectation that the critiques will be honest yet respectful. 
    I think that Kingston , on account of his seeming superior knowledge, got away with sounding less respectful in his critiques. 
    Nobody seemed to mind. 
    But maybe  he just overstepped the mark on this occasion? 
    It’s a fine line I suppose. Easy to cross it. 
    jswartzartRichard_PMoeyMichele
  • I’m sorry but I think that this is getting unfair. Are we talking about recent transgressions or ones that happened more than a year ago?  Since Kingston came back it looked like he went to a great deal of time and effort to share what he knows. Yes, he was brusk and some of his input was above my level, but if he overstepped or bullied since he returned I’m not aware of it. 
  • Hi @Martin_J_Crane, I could give you an example, but everything has been deleted. I will stand by what I have written however it does feel a bit like I’m talking behind his back and he’s not here to defend himself, point taken. 
    Martin_J_Cranejswartzart
  • You know what, I think @Martin_J_Crane is right. I wouldn't go as far to say that he never overstepped or bullied. But perhaps this thread has simply turned into insulting Kingston and should be closed. 

    We can all remember what we learned from him, whether we agree with everything he said or not, without soiling his name. 
    Martin_J_CranejswartzartForgiveness
  • @Flatty, I'm in agreement with most of the above and think you should close this thread but not delete it.
    Flattymichalistassieguy
This discussion has been closed.