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English Rose and Peony WIP Master Study

So, I love Michael Klein - for me, he is the living Fantin-Latour of our time.  I have been trying fabulously unsuccessfully to paint flowers from my garden.  I even bought some gorgeous artificial peonies so the death factor wouldn't be an issue.  I got worse and worse and really, embarrassingly horrible.
So, I am trying my first master study.  I purchased Michael's flower video - watched it about 4 times and then decided to give it a go.  I have to say, it is exhausting because I am pausing, mixing, painting, re-winding, re-mixing, painting but I am learning a ton.
So far what I know:  I paint very, very thick.  I need to keep my shadows thin!  I am poor at mixing earth tones and missed the value of them with the primaries.  I'll show you my set up which is a corner of my studio that is a disaster - I am watching the video on my laptop and I have a high resolution photo of his finished painting on my Nixplay.
Today was day 2 for me and I have golf tomorrow so won't be able to finish it until this weekend :(.  I hate for some of my mixed paints to start drying but I have to trust that I can re-mix.
If you see something that sticks out immediately, I would love to know.  I am probably about half way done so there is a lot to do.  Thank you for your input.

RosanneJack2015KaustavtassieguyvinumblankForgivenesswerby

Comments

  • Very nice - maybe a little water level line in the vase, would help "strengthen" the vase presence but its very nice.

    JuliannaKaustav
  • edited October 5
    Lovely, @Julianna. The soft colours are great and the way you've done the petals makes them look beautifully delicate and the feeling of space between them and the wall is very convincing.. Once you get a highlight on the glass bowl it will really pop. It might be that you were holding the camera not quite horizontally but the table seems to slope up to the right. But, wait, now I look again I can see it's the camera or you cropped it crookedly so no problem there. I know you're only half finished but I think this will be a excellent floral still life. Very Fantin-Latour
    Julianna
  • @alsart    the vase will definitely have a water line - that is just the block in phase - I haven't touched the vase or purple/crimson flower since the block in.  This is a WIP and I have a lot of work to do - I suppose I am only halfway done.  Perhaps I should have waited until it is closer to being finished before posting.  I was just wondering if values are off or something really wonky that I am blind to at the moment.  That table needs to be leveled before I finish that off!  Thank you  :)
  • @tassieguy   thank you - you were typing as I was!  It's funny how that table really looks wonky in the photo - i'll use my level when it is time to finish that part.  This is difficult!
  • I love Michael Klein’s floral paintings too. If it’s difficult it means you’re learning a lot :)
    This is looking really promising- I think patience will be the key here.
    Renoir
  • This is quite lovely and I think you have a very good foundation. I must say, you do flowers lusciously!  I love the lighter colored flowers with the deeper peach/apricot/rose values and the thickness of your paint. It's distinctive and just lovely!

  • edited October 5
    One resolution for immaturely ( to your purpose) dead of flowers is that you can take a reference photo after setting up your subject. Adjust the exposure and colour balance it. It would be useful after all of your fresh flowers are dead? Lovely painting already by the way.Seeing waterline would make it look more complete as @alsart suggested.
  • I don't see anything bad in it! Probably a few highlights and shines are missing on the vase and the red flower needs a bit more fixing I guess.
  • Mark said to cover and keep your paint in the fridge. maybe that would help. coming along quite well. going to be beautiful.
    Renoir
  • Soft , dreamy and romantic. 
    Very easy on the eye. I think you’ve captured the softness and delicacy of the petals very well. The colours are beautiful. 

    I’m not sure , but it seems to me that the base of the bowl could be ever so slightly rounder.  It seems a little too flat. 
    Maybe someone else could comment on this. 

  • Really nice vase, it looks great with the water level and highlights.  Nice brushwork on the flowers, they have an old master feel to them.  Subtle color in all the petals.  Not your usual palette.

    I don't see much glare in the photo - a little by the fallen leaves.  I'm a little confused by the green between the two pink peonies.
    Julianna
  • you are so perceptive!  there is one leaf that I keep scraping because it just isn't correct between the two peonies - it has a very dark value and soon goes to a bump of highlight on the leaf and then to the cast shadow part of the leaf on bottom area - I have hated every pass/attempt so just rub it off with my VIva -  I think that tomorrow I will try that stupid leaf again and my guess is that will be my 80th attempt at getting it right.  :)    I did fix the table by turning it on it's side and it looks much better smoothed out.  It is amazing how much I have to learn and how much I thought I knew and how wrong I was!!!!  :)

    PaulBRenoir
  • Beautiful, @Julianna.  The bowel is not quite symmetrical. That is the only adjustment I would make. The petals are simply gorgeous and the flowers overall work so well against that background. Well done!
    H.M
  • It's coming along, getting more and more beautiful!
  • This is looking beautiful @Julianna. I really like the cooler colours you are working with.
  • @PaulB    do you see all those dots everywhere - as if a white canvas is showing through microscopically?  The panel is toned - there is no white canvas in those spots - it is like my DSLR RAW shooting camera picks up any little micro anything when I crop and edit a photo of one of my paintings.  I photographed paintings at museums and it just seems my camera does the same thing in that it is too microscopic in some sense.  I'd rather a polaroid.  I have spent countless hours trying to figure out how to photograph artwork at the expense of just painting.   I don't like a photograph of my painting to look so "off".   I am waiting for my photography lesson with my camera and oil paintings - it should be enlightening.  
  • Julianna said:
    @PaulB    do you see all those dots everywhere - as if a white canvas is showing through microscopically?  The panel is toned - there is no white canvas in those spots - it is like my DSLR RAW shooting camera picks up any little micro anything when I crop and edit a photo of one of my paintings.  I photographed paintings at museums and it just seems my camera does the same thing in that it is too microscopic in some sense.  I'd rather a polaroid.  I have spent countless hours trying to figure out how to photograph artwork at the expense of just painting.   I don't like a photograph of my painting to look so "off".   I am waiting for my photography lesson with my camera and oil paintings - it should be enlightening.  
    Ah yes, I see now, but I had to zoom in to do so though.

    I get the same problem.  I think it's because I photograph (more like wave my phone towards) under a strong 5000K light.  The light reflects off the paint, which is both wet and lumpy.  No wonder I get a lot of reflections.

    When I photographed my basement painting, I took it outside and propped it up on a trash can.  It was not in direct sun, nor was it a very sunny day, but it was bright.  The diffuse light made for a much better photograph.  It came out so much better than all the indoor, late-night post-session photos.  I will try and repeat that for the next one I varnish.

    I also took a photo of the trash can, which I'm painting now, for fun.  Don't ask.
    Julianna
  • Lovely painting @Julianna, it has a real classical feel. If you are still worried about the table line, I think the problem is the very left hand side edge, where there is a touch of dark fuzziness that leads the eye upward rather than off the edge of the canvas. Not sure if that makes sense?
  • its a lovely painting!.. the colors of flowers, how you painted the background, the table ... everything is working to make the painting beautiful.... I was just wondering whether some of the table colors would show through the vase or not, just curious!
    Bancroft414
  • Beautiful work so far. I agree with @anwesha and think that it would anchor the vase to the painting more.  I would think that there would have been some alteration of tone or color -- definitely refracted - of the water being effected by the table. But when looking at his painting on your tablet I see there no such variation.  Odd....
  • @Julianna - nice work, i like the single brush stroke in the vase, to represent the stalk.


  • I really like this @Julianna. It’s always painful when we compare ourselves to a master- I find it a bit debilitating..I wonder how many flower paintings MK did before this one? Also it looks like a Julianna painting so you have managed to keep your style and not just perfectly copied an MK- which is a good thing by the way  :)

    Julianna
  • Looks good to me!! Have you got the photo of the original you are trying to copy?
    Julianna
  • It's lovely, @Julianna! I especially love the way you've done the flowers. I've got to know your style now and so I think I know this was yours even if it was posted anonamously. Well done!  :)
    Julianna
  • Love the final painting. Initially I only saw 3 flowers but in the finished painting it defines the bouquet and I love the depth in the purple (from the get go that was the one I wondered if you were going to adjust lol) the vase the darker browns really took it to the next level, it all looks beautiful now!
    Julianna
  • @Julianna  I don’t hit the awesome button very often. This painting is awesome in the sense that you are redoing it looking for a piece of art. Looking with intent. Great!
    I think the color is way too raw. By raw I mean not neutralized. There are way to many ways s to neutralize and maintain a well mannered palette. 
    The table top and background are great the pione is good but a bit raw. The rawness makes it sit in an ambiguous space.
    The perspective though unusual has some historic precedent.
    The center color of the flowers in front are too dark in value and probably too raw in color. 
    I applaud you on this effort. Good try.
    Julianna
  • Superbly done @Julianna.Check  out the work of Nora Kasten. I think you’d love her style of painting.  

    Julianna
  • edited November 29
    Oh gosh, y'all are helping me so much.  I just lose sight of things when I am lost in painting and I don't know how to pull back. I was also getting very discouraged. My husband never liked the painting (he is loving and sweet about it, not artistic at all, so it wasn't rude - he just was "ehhh" about it)   He thought I was wasting my time trying again on linen but I have spent so much time trying to learn, I want to get as much as I can out of it.  Truly, I have flowers year round in my garden, I would love to just be able to go out any given day and pick a flower and paint it and be proud of it.  

     @Richard_P ; a high-def photo came with the video bundle I purchased and out of respect for the artist, I will just post a regular image that can be found online (just don't laugh!). Truly, I think he is a master and I am a sponge.  He draws with his brush so every painting is different - I wasn't trying to "copy" as you do so brilliantly, I was trying to copy in the sense of making beautiful, romantic flowers.  So be gentle with "spot the difference" :).  http://www.michaelkleinpaintings.com/paintings/

    MK likes to do what he calls "slam in the lights" and that is right up my alley!  I even got his set of brushes from Rosemary&co because I never painted with so many rounds before - he uses rounds for almost everything.  Well, newsflash!  It ain't the brushes because the linen this week was painted exclusively with his set of brushes.  I even used his palette this time:  these are my notes on the back - I think of it like a piano  

    I may try the MK arrangement again.  Unfortunately, this is my last day to paint for a while so I just picked a perfect little white rose (with 3 amazing pinkish buds) from my garden and put it in a little jar and am going to paint it today.  This will be a test to see if I've improved.

    @Kingston oh my goodness gracious - RAW is killing me - with my camera and my paintings!  I think you may have hit the nail on the head - I am keeping my strings of color mixtures separate (thinking I am keeping everything clean) - instead there is no meshing of the entire scene.  At his tweaking stage, Michael said the centers of his peonies didn't have enough - they needed to be more vibrant (I thought, well, I'm not gonna have that problem!) so it's funny that is one of the things you noticed!  

    The most important lesson I know I need to learn right now is what Mr. Carder said about being subtle.  I have never been subtle in my life and I know it will take my paintings to another level.  I will try to paint my beautiful white rose with love and gentleness and notice her beautiful subtleties today - wish me well.

    Thank you again, genuinely, I value this forum and Mr. Carder's generosity.  I would love to see Rosemary & Co do a set of Carder brushes for us to purchase.  Heck, Mr. Carder may be making his own brushes soon - he can make everything else!

  • A flamboyant style artist trying to paint Carder's style of subtlety would probably benefit from a few stiff drinks before painting. In other words I think it would be difficult to learn from two teachers at the same time. Mostly because almost all the knowledge is subjective and experiential. For myself, I've decided to abandon all that has gone before and concentrate on learning Carder's method until I can paint realism with a clear and competent understanding of what and why I'm doing it. Then after that I hope to learn from Tischner, Michael James Smith and a few other realists.
    Julianna
  • I haven't had chance to look at the original photo yet, but a quick post:

    Here is the colours of the spectrum against a vivid background:


    And now against a neutral grey background:


    See how more vivid and stronger the colours appear on a less vibrant background when they aren't fighting for attention with another dominant colour?

    Now imagine the flowers are those colours and the background, table and vase are the greys. See how it would make them more vibrant and the focus of attention?

    Julianna
  • @BOB73 ; that is one thing I never do, is drink while painting - that is a sure way to ruin a canvas.  I'll take that into consideration however.  I have a thousand teachers for many things in my life - I am not a disciple of anyone but am a student of many.  I wish you would start posting your work!!!  You have such insightful commentary - I look forward to the reveal.  Seriously.  

    @Richard_P ; isn't that amazing!  And when I see the beautiful colors, I get so excited and I want to make them even more beautiful and thus, come up with obnoxious paintings.  And then, what I do, is try to find a dash of a compliment to set next to a beautiful color to really take it over the edge.  Geez, you'd think I'd learn.  Subtle.......Subtle.............Subtle............  needs to be plastered all over my easel.  If I get a hint of popping a color I need to stop.  Thank you.   Seriously, though, don't do spot the difference with MK's beautiful flower painting because I know it is very time consuming for you to do so.  I was obnoxious with some colors and I know it.  Must try better next time to calm myself down.  :)

    I have my still like set up and composition figured out.  I'll post photos later (unless i'm too embarrassed).  thank you again   I needed that


  • I write better than I paint and I can justify my opinions as being as good as Einstein's opinions but not my math. I can hide words in innuendo but paintings are blatant facts. I'm opening boxes looking for my art stuff but have to take a lot back to storage. Still don't have enough space to properly paint.
  • @Julianna. I went to MKlein’s site and saw the original of this piece. Beautiful. Hardly a raw color In fact I saw no raw spectral color. Just Neutrals. And so many tube colors on the palette. I’d go insane. I’m working on something to explain my understanding of neutral colors and how to achieve them. How to make exciting color correct and quick.
    Julianna
  • Julianna said:
    @Richard_P ; isn't that amazing!  And when I see the beautiful colors, I get so excited and I want to make them even more beautiful and thus, come up with obnoxious paintings.  And then, what I do, is try to find a dash of a compliment to set next to a beautiful color to really take it over the edge.  Geez, you'd think I'd learn.  Subtle.......Subtle.............Subtle............  needs to be plastered all over my easel.  If I get a hint of popping a color I need to stop.  Thank you.   Seriously, though, don't do spot the difference with MK's beautiful flower painting because I know it is very time consuming for you to do so.  I was obnoxious with some colors and I know it.  Must try better next time to calm myself down.  :)

    I have my still like set up and composition figured out.  I'll post photos later (unless i'm too embarrassed).  thank you again   I needed that
    I think if you just made the wooden table less vibrant it would help straight away. :) I do like your colours in the flowers though!
    Julianna
  • @Kingston, RE neutral colors; I was hoping you would explain. Spectrally speaking, I'm in the dark.
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