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WIP - Cinque Terre

1356714

Comments

  • You will have set a DMP record on all fronts, having painted everything there is to paint architecturally the most number of times--haha.
    PaulBBOB73
  • Day 15 (64 hours in)

    I would like some feedback on the ocean surface texture.  I added just a little of it right in that little inlet, and want to know if it's working, or whether I'm overdoing the detail on the surface.  I have a feeling I could/should get away with less.

    I'm starting to notice that the color of one house is reflecting off the next one, but only when zoomed way in.  I'm adding a little of that, for depth.

    Found four windows I forgot to paint.



    I also salvaged the boat, but I'm still not happy with it, and may sink it again.



    Petere
  • I think the bit of sea you've done works well, @PaulB. Just do it bit by bit with correct values until you get the canvas covered and then you'll be better able to see whether you need more detail in parts of the sea. My inclination would be to treat it fairly broadly until then.
    PaulB
  • I'm glad you found some more windows to paint, you clearly need a few more.

    I don't mind the pattern you have put in the sea, but the contrast between the lightest and darkest ripples could be a bit too high. You could try stabbing a dry brush over it, to fuzz it up a bit and to reduce the contrast. Or given it is in the distance, and the water area is so big, you could just leave it smooth and indistinct (which would also help with atmospheric perspective), but add some broad scale variability in value and colour (like in the photo) to break the area up. Might just be a case of experimenting.

    Don't sink you boat just yet. I think what is putting they eye off is the dark band on the inside of the boat closest to the viewer - its kind of ambiguous what it actually is.

    The buildings you have painted so far are terrific. 
    PaulB
  • The sea looks ok to me @PaulB, I think I would agree with Rob on the way to approach this.
    The lonely blue boat is fine, just needs some context and some mates.
    This is coming along really well, and I'm enjoying your updates
    PaulB
  • @tassieguy Thanks.  I think you said it, "correct values", and I don't quite have those right.

    @Roxy Thanks.  You're right, I've got the contrast too high, and I need to tone that down.  I figured I would lower the contrast as it goes into the distance, to the point where I just stop.

    The boat has that dark thing - I think it might be a mast or a paddle, I can't really tell.  But it exists, so I painted it.  Here it is from the photo:



    It's a lot clearer there, and now it's obvious that I did not render that well.  The perspective is still not a match.  I have a lot of adjustments to make.  Thanks for pointing that out, now it's clear why I don't like it.
  • Pretty sure it's an oar, there's one on the other side. Thanks for posting the photo of the boat, I can see now there is a gap of lighter value between the oar and the boat.
    RenoirPaulB
  • Looks ok to me Paul, don't worry about the sea's surface for now. Step back, way back and look at it as a whole. 
    PaulB
  • Great project Paul, mad challenge of course but got a feeling it will be epic when finished!!  :)How did you make the drawing for accuracy - grid, projector, freehand?
    PaulB
  • Coach_T01 said:
    Great project Paul, mad challenge of course but got a feeling it will be epic when finished!!  :)How did you make the drawing for accuracy - grid, projector, freehand?
    Thanks @Coach_T01.  At first I thought this was a beautiful photograph, but then realized it could also be an assault course that could train me to do all kinds of things I have not yet done, which are:
    • Create a relatively accurate detailed drawing, specifically one where if I make a large mistake, it will be obvious to all.
    • Get to try out a large Dibond panel as a substrate.
    • Do a painting mostly standing up, also one where I can't hold it in one hand and paint with the other.  I usually prefer small panels, which essentially don't need an easel.
    • Paint tiny figures in a semi-impressionistic way.  I'm used to being able to paint every little detail, but here I can only suggest form and color.
    • Deal with a large ocean surface.
    • A large painting, this is 120cm x 80cm, and I've only done 30cm x 25cm and smaller before.
    • Use lots of color groups, including some earth tone, and some synthetic.
    • Stop using solvents.  This one is all Geneva paint and brush dip, no nasty stuff.
    • Try painting rocks, stonework, hillside, trees, ... umbrellas.
    The only thing I don't need to learn for this is the discipline to break it down and work on it long term.  That said, I do plan on making a dozen other paintings while this one is in progress, just to keep it all interesting for me.

    The drawing was done from a 11" x 8.5" black and white printout with a grid drawn on it.  I then placed some key points (those which lie on the grid lines) for accuracy, then sketched in the rest using an 11" x 17" laminated high quality print with no grid.  This is not a perfect technique, and there are many small errors.  The drawing took a long time, and if you scroll back here and you'll see that it's still not really done.  The bottom 50% of the panel is not properly drawn yet.
    Summer
  • @PaulB   You've seen this before but it deserves another look and might give you a little inspiration and tips to help you through some of the difficult spots.
    http://forum.drawmixpaint.com/discussion/comment/44326/#Comment_44326
  • @BOB73 It does indeed deserve another look, thank you.  I'm not going for that level of quality, instead just cramming a lot of learning into one project.
  • Day 16 (68 hours in)

    Another building done, working my way along the skyline.  It's certainly becoming colorful, although this picture is quite dark.



    The palette is a mess, and I have almost nothing in the way of steps.  I'm finding that Geneva black consistently dries on my palette first, in just a couple of days, with Burnt Umber close behind.  Titanium white and Cadmium Yellow barely change consistency.

    Now that I have wrapped some masking tape around the brush handle, it has become a little sticky, and I'm no longer dropping it every day.



    I've started placing a small storage bin lid over the palette when I'm done for the day.  It eliminates my fluff problem.





    SummerJulianna
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    I do exactly the same thing.  It works for me as well.  I add a cotton ball with a tiny bit of clove oil in some spot away from the oil paint, because it will run into the paints if the cotton ball has too much clove oil in it--learned that the hard way.  The cotton ball and clove oil keeps everything moist.  The cover also keeps the dust out of the paints.  :)
    PaulB
  • @PaulB Have you looked into brushes with a wider handle or the ones with a rubber/plastic soft grip? That might help you.
    PaulB
  • @Richard_P ; I'm looking for soft grips too, especially for the skinny handle brushes. 
    PaulB
  • @Richard_P, @BOB73 I've considered getting pencil grips (there are both office and art supply variants of these) for the brushes.  But I stopped looking once the masking tape worked well for me.

    Not looking to replace brushes.  I have too many of them, and I tend to use only one, and it's the same one I started with in February.  I think I've purchased everything three times now.  All part of my learning process.
  • Thanks Paul, I've tried a few of those even the triangle shapes. For me they were either too fat or just not long enough. I tried mole skin and that worked but had to be glued to the shaft then after a few weeks the skin hardened and became slippery. Besides I lost my itty-bitty skinning knife.
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    What in the world are you guys talking about?  Slippery?  Fat?  Not long enough?  Mole skin?  Pencil grips?  Soft grips?  Rubber?  Plastic?  Aren't we supposed to be painting with the brush between the thumb and the index finger to avoid most of these problems?  I admit that at first it was difficult to paint this way.  But, now, I see that it is necessary to maintain the abstraction.  But most of all, it is less tiring.  Now I'm really confused.  What exactly is the distress you speak of and why?  And why are there so many handles to choose from?  Have a look at these?  Would appreciate feedback.   :)   Summer

    https://www.google.com/search?q=paint+brush+handles&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls={moz:distributionID}:{moz:locale}:{moz:official}&tbm=isch&gws_rd=ssl



    PaulB
  • Summer said:
    What in the world are you guys talking about?
    @Summer, here's my problem (granted, it's not a big problem), I'm using miniature child size brushes.  This is a Rosemary & Co rigger brush, which I love, but the varnished handle is tiny and slippery, and none of this is helped by the way I hold it, which is very loosely.  If I grip it tighter my hand gets tired.



    Because of the size, slipperiness and loose grip, I keep dropping it.  So I wrapped masking tape around the handle, and I'm happy now.



    Now see this pen, it has a rubbery grip thing, and you can buy those for pencils.  Unfortunately you need skinny ones to fit and grip a paintbrush.



    As for holding the paintbrush properly, well, I don't.
    SummerJulianna
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    Just saying that the pencil grip method of painting is very tiring for me and a person would have to have a paintbrush fit their particular hands and then there would be the moisture problem.  The horizontal method of painting is like painting without a brush at all.  The arm and hand just guide the brush along.  It's easier to maintain the abstraction when adding the paint to the canvas in this way because the brain doesn't try to interfere.  Just my own experience with brushes at this stage in my life.   Just saying.  Summer
  • Masking tape is the best for this, especially for maintaining good control of your brush.
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    I would have first tried sanding off the varnish to get a better grip--even some of the ferrule.
    Forgiveness
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    Then I would have tried taping the brush to my index finger after shortening the handle, or maybe not, depending on position, making my finger the handle and holding my thumb against the index finger for extra support.  This would work for me.
    ForgivenessPaulB
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    And, for sure, I'd be wearing this (I have two different sizes.): 

    An opti-visor


    Forgiveness
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    Yes, I see the problem now.  I hope you will let us know if you get this resolved.  Your painting is simply amazing.  Summer
    PaulB
  • Wow have you made progress on this!  I think it is looking fantastic and hope you find some relief from your fatigue issues.  
    PaulB
  • I think you mentioned that eventually you want to be able to paint in a looser style. Another good reason to do this is for the health of your wrist, neck, eyes, and so on.
  • Thank you for your concern, but I need to clarify: No pain, fatigue, or problems.  If I paint for 8 hours with a tight grip on the brush, my hand aches.  So I paint for 8 hours with a loose grip, and it's fine.  Except then I drop the brush twice a day.  Masking tape fixed that.  All is well, no complaints.
    SummerJulianna
  • PaulB

    When the masking tape turns to grotty mush.





    Denis

    PaulBSummer
  • PaulBPaulB -
    edited September 2017
    Day 17 (72.5 hours in)

    Slow progress.  Managed to lean on the palette without realizing it.



    Area shown 25cm x 14cm, 3.6%
    Buildings rendered: 9%
    BoudiccaSummer
  • PaulB

    O Ye of the multi coloured elbows. You have completed 100% of the ocean and 100% of the Windows.

    Denis

    PaulB
  • That's a really big work you are doing!
    PaulB
  • It's looking really good @PaulB. I had to go back to the beginning of the thread to remind myself how big this is and how much there is to do.
    PaulB
  • @PaulB I hope you are not suggesting that I should paint with my elbows? @Summer I have shaky hands and am fumble fingered. The thumb and forefinger grip is too tiring and I lose control especially with the skinny handles. I hold the brush like a conductor holds a baton when I do large areas but this isn't good for detail work. When I get back to painting I'm going to stick the brush handle through a marshmallow and try that. 
    SummerPaulB
  • I forgot to say @PaulB I think your progress is tremendous.
    PaulB
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    BOB73 said:
    @PaulB I hope you are not suggesting that I should paint with my elbows? @Summer I have shaky hands and am fumble fingered. The thumb and forefinger grip is too tiring and I lose control especially with the skinny handles. I hold the brush like a conductor holds a baton when I do large areas but this isn't good for detail work. When I get back to painting I'm going to stick the brush handle through a marshmallow and try that. 
    Haha.  When my hands get shaky at times - caffeine - I hold my wrist with the other hand.  It seems to fool my brain and calm both of the hands down.  So far, it works for me.  We really have the most amazing problems to overcome as a group, don't we.  But somehow, we do.  Summer
    BOB73PaulB
  • SummerSummer -
    edited September 2017
    @BOB73, @PaulB ; I had a dream last night that I laid a paintbrush on my index finger and my husband was laying a wide bead of clear caulking compound to secure one to the other.  The smell of compound woke me up.  I'm wondering now if this is an idea worth pursuing because the compound happens to peel off easily?  I'll keep it in mind for the future.  Hmm.  Summer
    PaulB
  • OMG that is pure patience and determine but will come out great 
    PaulB
  • Richard_P said:
    ...
    Is that one of those Rosemary & Co tennis balls?  Size 8?
    BoudiccaKaustavSummer
  • PaulBPaulB -
    edited September 2017
    Day 18 (76 hours in)

    A mixed bag today.  More dirty-colored houses rendered:



    Then I thought, let's go down to the square and put in some color.  Because, you know, it will be fun.



    It was not fun.  I think I've hit the limit of detail with alla prima.  I need to let this dry and go back to move the lines around and change a few colors because I have lost the umbrella shapes.  I can't even talk about that striped awning.  I colored the outline in black, temporarily, because I needed something for contrast, because those bright colors look awful against that white.

    Yikes.
    Summer
  • I get freaked out just watching.

    I love the colours in those umbrellas.
    SummerRenoir
  • edited September 2017
    It's coming along nicely, @PaulB. Just be patient. Don't look at how much is still to do. Just concentrate on one small section at a time and do each section as well as you can. You'll be surprised how quickly you'll seem get it done by not thinking about the end. Even if you only do a few square inches a day, if you do them well, the whole will emerge and the end result will be magical.
    PaulBRenoir
  • Given the scale of the beast I think your umbrellas and the awning will look just fine. I'd move on and then only re-visit them once you have the surrounding area filled. 


    PaulBRenoir
  • I love this thread.  I literally laughed out loud at the tennis ball.  The painting is outstanding.  All the work that is being done lately is so personal.  How would any of us ever sell something?
    PaulB
  • tassieguy said:
    .... Just be patient. Don't look at how much is still to do. Just concentrate on one small section at a time and do each section as well as you can. You'll be surprised how quickly you'll seem get it done by not thinking about the end. ...
    I agree, slow and steady, and this will get finished, even if it does take me well into 2018.  I'm enjoying the enormity of this task, my update posts are all done after midnight, which might explain the hints of frustration.  I suppose it does read like a pain journal.

    It's not that different from writing software, if you look only at the high level.  I have a clear goal, an adequate sketch of the whole structure, a few key pieces in place, and the rest is just iteration and testing.

    When complete, I'll most likely start another big complex painting.  But not one that is so large it blocks access to shelving and the desk.
    Renoir
  • Roxy said:
    Given the scale of the beast I think your umbrellas and the awning will look just fine. I'd move on and then only re-visit them once you have the surrounding area filled. 
    You're right.  In the light of a new day, it looks much better.  I will just move on.  Most likely, my list of flaws to fix will be long, and this won't be high on the list.
    RenoirJulianna
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